history of dnb in brisbane (controversial??) - via spraci post

another post from spraci - where all the discussion happened a few years back & people reminisced.

this one's a little controversial. so skip over the politics, though it does happen a bit in brisbane so I guess is reflective of the place in one respect

http://www.spraci.com/cgi-bin/boards.cgi?area=brisbane&task=show&id=3309...

WTF Journeyman??????

Posted by Neurojack on Tuesday, 11th December 2001 3:00 PM
203.46.38.226

WTF?...

>at last this sound has been exposed to so many headz for the first time, matt(neurojack) and myself have been pushing this sound over the years...

>> Don't bloody kid yourself Jason !.. u tryin to steal my sound..ie. mixes/tracklistings/labels.. and playing them very badly ! I don't think calls for recognition !!!! U gotta have the background in the sound ! The amount of times I have heard you say to people "Yeh I play the same stuff as Neurojack"...why not say "Yeh I copy Neurojack's sets..(very badly!) so you should get me to play instead " !
As far as I'm concerned you have personally stopped "me" from getting gig's in Brisbane !
Were you playin DnB before I left for overseas ? No. Were you highly against Jungle/DnB before it became popular ? Yes. hypocritical ? Yes.

>yeah a few sound problems etc...i copped alot of bukem's frustration trying to sort out drinks and sound shit...

>> You live in a dream Boyee !.. yeh turning up the bloody monitors to distortion level, while I was in the mix (ie. crossfader in the middle!)is really sortin out sound probs ? Then, annoying both LTJ and Conrad all night... yeh really helped m8 !!!
and why were you even in the crew area ??

**You need your head-read m8 !

Neurojack :(

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Re: WTF Journeyman??????

Posted by Neurojack on Tuesday, 11th December 2001 5:28 PM
203.46.38.226

>>Nice ego you have there buddy. Real nice for a #### albino asshole.
Fuck you, youabitch, next time we cross paths, YOU DA BITCH!

>Justification please ??
If u read my post.. I have provided 'just cause' for my action ! anyone who knows me, including Jason Reed know that I am not an "#### albino asshole"... but extremely passionate about my interests! and if I feel that someone is 'ripping me off' then they should be exposed before it goes any further ! yeh ?

Neurojack

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Re: WTF Journeyman??????

Posted by dms0 on Tuesday, 11th December 2001 4:29 PM
139.130.2.62

damn you schadrach, we were going again well before your post, in fact, we've been going again at it well before you even started going!

so dont try and take all the credit for being the first to go again at going again, in fact are you even going at all? does anybody know where your going? you suck so hard at going again that its just embarrasing

youd better watch out if we decide to go again and get going because well be going to get you. so get going, but make sure your not going our way again cos well 'ave to go 'ave words with you again...

dms0
-= 'aaigght? =-

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Re: WTF Journeyman??????

Posted by haters on Wednesday, 12th December 2001 12:42 AM
203.45.188.56

Damn, Neurojack sounds like a real fuckwit... I'll never suppport his shit.

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Re: WTF Journeyman??????

Posted by DRi- on Wednesday, 12th December 2001 8:19 PM
203.164.82.126

WELL dms0!!!!! you wanna anotha go?????????

(one fish two fish, clinton fish, aiiight, shine ya shoes guv'na, kitty likes his leash, whats a joke, dirty undy fetish, four balls at once wit da rockin' swede... take DAT mudda fucka!)

its on

again

"damn you schadrach, we were going again well before your post, in fact, we've been going again at it well before you even started going!

so dont try and take all the credit for being the first to go again at going again, in fact are you even going at all? does anybody know where your going? you suck so hard at going again that its just embarrasing

youd better watch out if we decide to go again and get going because well be going to get you. so get going, but make sure your not going our way again cos well 'ave to go 'ave words with you again...

dms0
-= 'aaigght? =- "

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Re: WTF Journeyman??????

Posted by journeyman on Tuesday, 11th December 2001 10:07 PM
210.49.20.22

rarly do i have to come on hear to defend myself , but when people start SLANDERING (an offense in the courts) my name across spraci i think some TRUTHS need to be heard, i'm not even sure if its you matt as i wouldn't think you could stoop so low, i'm dissapointed,and if it is you its easy to see where the hidden agenda is, your the only one in brisbane who wants to be a known as the main dj associated with this sound and with bukem and the fact that some one else is pushing it rattles your ego, and i'm disgusted that i have to be dragged into these petty little ego wars ! no one owns a sound or a record unless you've produced yourself, and i have written two tracks 4 years ago, we are allways playing someone else music , don't forget that

anyway here's the real facts -stealing your sound! - i shop alone and bought my first good looking record at central by myself in 95 it was horizons by bukem, i didn't even know you that well then ! a couple of years later on occasions i would put 2 copies away, one for you and one for mysef as we both had the same taste, there was no problem then ay !

playing them badly! - just your opinion ! i will not mention what really hapened in sydney ayy !

must have a background in the sound! - how long does the background have to be 10 years 5,whats the criteria, its all just different beats and sounds mixed the same way regardless of time mixing one sound, i'm a dj i mix records for pleasure whatever the sound i like at the time, 7 years to be exact !

heard me say to others! 'yeh i play the same sound as neuro' more like if you book me don't put matt and i together as we have a similiar sound ! were you standing next to me to hear this....hearsay!

copying your sets - do you send me a list of your pre programed sets ? when dj's end up with the same records at the same time its allways likely that mixes will be similiar !

stopped you from getting gigs - i have given you gigs, remember creation a few years ago you didn't bother to turn up, the dnb room at zen warehouse party i booked you and also the guest spots at dnb social club....and i have reccomended you to jeff and killian at mantra, why have you not booked neurojack were my exact words! and i was just about to reccomend you to micolai at strictly business !

were you playing dnb before i went overseas - yes i started mixing in a bit of dnb in 94 at the dome/ask frenzy! and at parties in late 96 early 97 and especially when LUSH was open, remember in early 97 we used to have mix sessions with cameron brown on the mike at my place quite often and in fact we did a mix tape at your house before you went overseas and you sent the tape to glo and a letter came back signed by bukem/with thanks, you one one side me on the other ! funny how that gets forgotten ! i used to tell everyone that matt got a letter from bukem ! but never once mentioned myself !

you were against it before it became popular - when exactly did it become popular?....i was playing it when it was unpopular see above ! and i have never said a bad word against it in fact i allways liked the ragga stuff you used to play at such events as market day years ago,the jungle room at the roxy years ago and a set at raze's party a babylon in 96 ! and also was aware of michael hoggs sets at underground parties. i was just more into trance back then!

turning up the monitors during your set - i arrived backstage to see you shouting at me "the monitors shitting it self, so i got up and thought i would help by turning in down slightley then you nodded your head "ok" !

annoying bukem and conrad all night- i arrived at 12:oo sat down and was enjoying your set(and a beautifull girl) only to see an unhappy bukem walk past looking for some water, so i went up and asked if i could help, he was pretty pissed off and he didn't even want to do the gig until things were provided "i'm gonna smoke some weed, i'm gonna pull this gig" were his exact words, so i asked what do i have to do to get you up there, "get me the promotor, get me some water get the sound guys, so i got got security to make the calls and arrange it! meanwhile i bought 4 bottles of water(ask erther) and antonne was chasing up the main sound guy this was all happening while you were up their mixing matt ! "where's the toilet" (bukem) follow me, i said, the waters on its way, anything else you need , get those cameras out of here (conrad) no camera's, actually bukem said he appreciated what i was doing but thought i shouldn't have to buy water,you paid to hear me you shouldn't buy water i never told him i dj'ed earlier (for free) and $ 8 bucks is nothing compared to the thousands of dollars i've spent on his records over the years, if this is what you call annoying these guys all night when theirs no one else their to help and telling me what are you doing in the backstage area, and when you finished i was first to congratulate you on your set, now your attacking me ! and as a matter of fact i just got an email today from the a&r manager at good looking records - ltj thanks you for giving him the demo cd its not what he's after but still wants more demo's as he wants to hear new stuff coming from australia,!!!

one last note - you ask me what i was doing backstage ! i opened up the room i have a right to be there, i had no problems with the the decks jumping as that was easily worked out by using common sense and bieng carefull , i had no problems with monitor even with mc supaswift coming through it, just tweek it to the right level, its all about expierience and common sense and making do with what your given.

coming on here and dissing me openly is dissing the whole scene and discrediting yourself, because everyone who reads this thinks "here we go , the dnb heads are at it again and the scene gets laughted at yet again...no wonder drum n bass has trouble bieng accepted in brisbane,this is the reason why !

Responses

* Re: WTF Journeyman??????
haters -- Wednesday, 12th December 2001 12:42 AM
* Re: WTF Journeyman??????
AliaK -- Wednesday, 12th December 2001 1:14 AM
o Re: WTF Journeyman??????
AliaK -- Wednesday, 12th December 2001 1:20 AM
o Re: WTF Journeyman??????
Neurojack -- Wednesday, 12th December 2001 7:14 PM
+ Re: WTF Journeyman?????? [long and disjointed reply]
AliaK -- Thursday, 13th December 2001 1:45 AM
# Re: WTF Journeyman?????? [long and disjointed reply]
Custa -- Thursday, 13th December 2001 4:02 AM
* Re: WTF Journeyman??????
Neurojack -- Wednesday, 12th December 2001 5:14 PM
o Re: WTF Journeyman??????
dom -- Wednesday, 12th December 2001 6:32 PM
+ Re: WTF Journeyman??????
:/ -- Wednesday, 12th December 2001 6:39 PM
o Re: WTF Journeyman??????
journeyman -- Wednesday, 12th December 2001 7:54 PM
+ Re: WTF Journeyman??????
Neurojack -- Thursday, 13th December 2001 11:27 AM
# Hey Neurojack...
Idiot -- Thursday, 13th December 2001 1:21 PM
* Re: Hey Neurojack...
Neurojack -- Thursday, 13th December 2001 1:36 PM
o more>>

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Re: WTF Journeyman??????

Posted by AliaK on Wednesday, 12th December 2001 1:14 AM
198.142.218.6

even though we've never met in person Neurojack, and it's not really my place to comment, if it's any consolation, every time I've ever spoken to Journeyman he's always spoken very highly of you and we've discussed dnb a fair bit as I have a few of those style records as well. jason had also mentioned all that he said about bukem in the post when I saw him that night whilst you were playing.. from the look on bukem's face and his mannerisms before he started I could imagine him not playing (as background info, I was paying particular attention to it all, because bukem and the orb were the main reasons I was there - I'd flown up from sydney, missed a flight, bought another plane ticket and was shocked to hear he might not play at all due to lack of water and unstable decks!) I'm not wanting to take sides, one because I'm sure I don't know all the facts which has led up to this and two because I think you both play nice music and are obviously both very passionate about it.

just some comments: I took a photo of the crowd whilst you were playing and remembered taking another one a couple of years ago or last year whenever it was that the dnb room was introduced to adventjah and was so happy to see how much the crowd has increased and how many more people were into dnb these days - it's really taken off which was great to see. internal fighting between djs starts to spoil this feeling, obviously there's a lot of bottled up feelings out there and I'd personally rather not read them on a public message board. I'm sure other punters don't need to see it either. I know noone forces me to read, but it's this addiction I have - I'm thinking now that moving away and reading abusive posts is a great cure for it though :((

I think it'd be hard to say that one person or one crew was responsible for one style of dnb.. I think it's just the changing patterns of the fickle party crowd which seems to be moving away from the harder beats to the more breakbeat orientated sound and the fact that many of the ex-grunge crowd are making it the breaks/hip hop/dnb
gigs since many of their bands moved to melb and other southern destinations.

in saying that, personally I have a lot of respect for Journeyman because he doesn't just speak passionately about the music he loves, he does something about it - puts on gigs, actively contacts promoters asking about gigs and if they would be interested in trying a dnb/2 step night. and I realise that not everyone has the time/energy/means/whatever to do this themselves, especially on their own without the backing (and popularity?) of a crew. there's not too many people who are willing to promote others and not just themselves, so I don't have a problem with people doing some self-promotion if their heart is in the right place.

(not directed to anyone inparticular, just general comments now) and really, does it matter who started playing the music first or what gigs they're getting or not getting? most styles of music have been around for a while. and does it really matter if people play more than one style either now or in their total career? I'd think it would get a little boring after a while playing the same thing forever, change is good. this is all just dj ego stuff and there's already too much of that to go around on all sides. I think it'd all be better off if the djs went back to wearing brown paper bags over their heads with cutout eyes and everyone calling themselves dj keith so that everyone was equal and it really was the music that was the focus. the punters could all start worshipping dj keith then, which would be the idea of someone playing their fav music, not an actual person. in fact someone should do a party these days and the only one on the bill is dj keith and when u arrive it's a surprise as to what u hear and u never really know who it is that's playing... people could come out to see dj keith not dj ego! ... but I digress.. (& I'm sure everyone's so touchy atm that they won't appreciate that attempt at humour anyway..)

brisbane people were starting to work together and things were happening, (and yes I wear rose coloured glasses, they suit me ok ;)
anyway, please no more dnb wars, no hip hop wars, no techno wars, no house wars, not even any nrg wars. tolerance is a great thing to have and if you people use it well they might be surprised.

anyway, another post that skewed off track, it's been a while. think calm.. have you listened to any lush ambient in a while? it has a nice soothing effect and I highly recommend it to all ;)

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Re: WTF Journeyman??????

Posted by AliaK on Wednesday, 12th December 2001 1:20 AM
198.142.218.6

>> brisbane people were starting to work together and things were happening, (and yes I wear rose coloured glasses, they suit me ok ;)
anyway, please no more dnb wars, no hip hop wars, no techno wars, no house wars, not even any nrg wars. tolerance is a great thing to have and if you people use it well they might be surprised.

oops that was supposed to read "if people use it well they might be surprised" (wrote it faster than I hit the backspace key)

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Re: WTF Journeyman??????

Posted by Neurojack on Wednesday, 12th December 2001 7:14 PM
203.46.38.226

Hello,

>>I'd flown up from sydney, missed a flight, bought another plane ticket and was shocked to hear he might not play at all due to lack of water and unstable decks!)
> Yes, I was at Gatecrasher (Melbourne) the week before, and had witnessed the major major technical ####-up's there prior to LTJ playin. Even though the sound for James Lavelle who had just stepped off was fine !..
Believe it or not, LTJ considers me to be the "Australian representative" for progressive DnB !.. and for his labe(Goodlooking)..
though you wouldn't know it from my actions(frustrations) living in Bris of late I guess..

>>I think you both play nice music and are obviously both very
passionate about it.
>Thanks heeps, but for an insight into some my 'reasons' please read my reply to Jason !.. yes, we go way back.. I have known Jason for a long time.. and had/spent plenty of time for him ! Just recently a lot has come out of the 'woodwork' which has displeased me greatly !
Feel I have been betrayed etc... and it can't go on !
I am definately not the sort of person to just go and cause trouble believe me, in fact the opposite !

>>internal fighting between djs starts to spoil this feeling, obviously there's a lot of bottled up feelings...
> In nutshell, there are people who have just 'jumped the bandwagon' due to the ever growing populartity of DnB and tryin to run things... when there was already things in place.. however this is becoming extremely evident in all electronic scenes in Bris ! so evrything is getting a tainted unproffessional feeling.. have lived o/s and currently spend alot of time in other states in Aus, Bris is very unique this way :(

>I think it'd be hard to say that one person or one crew was responsible for one style of dnb..
>>Oh, please don't affiliate me with any crews or other dj's.. I have always been a 100% strictly independent.. I was to begin with, so there is no reason to change now.. but yeh everytime I meet a new person, I get associated with this person or that person etc...

>>breakbeat orientated sound and the fact that many of the ex-grunge crowd are making it the breaks/hip hop/dnb gigs since many of their bands moved to melb and other southern destinations.
> Yes, I've noticed the change in pop of breaks in Bris since end of 97...yes very true about the band thing....

>>in saying that, personally I have a lot of respect for Journeyman because he doesn't just speak passionately about the music he loves, he does something about it - puts on gigs,
actively contacts promoters asking about gigs and if they would be interested in trying a
dnb/2 step night.
> Yeh OK full-prop's...there are just an ever increasing stories of dj/promters...is this healthy ?.. are we gaining anything ?
Is it possible for some people to simple enjoy the art of dj-ing (and be good at it!) without having to bloody put on your own parties and get 'respect' in Brisbane ?
I spend my whole week doing promotions/graphic design/websites/cd-roms/video production-editing / and organising conferences..
get to the weekend and I just want to DJ.. not what I have just spent the last 50hrs doin... yeh ?

>>self-promotion if their heart is in the right place.
> It's all for the music ! and getting it out there !... LTJ put me on a mission a long time ago... he was so shocked when I told him I have no club residency in Brisbane ! and I'm sposed to be a representative of his music in Aus... yet I go to other states Syd / Melbourne.. I get full respect & props... and offered gig's...
dunno ?

>>and really, does itmatter who started playing the music first or what gigs they're getting or not getting?
> think 'history' is very important! helps to build a stable foundation for the future.. You cannot deny your history !
But create a false history and ?... the end !

>>and does it really matter if peopleplay more than one style either now or in their total career?
> No, not at all....get to sundays and I just wanna chill.. that's strictly downtempo / house for me...
but I don't go sayin that a particaular style of music is crap.. and then 3yrs later decide that's it's all of a sudden not, because there are more people into it... music is a lot deeper than that for me.. more of an inner thing rather than a surface/populartity thing....

>>dj ego stuff
> What does that mean exactly... shouldn't mix ego w/ confidence ! totally different... like most ego dj's are pretty crap... it's the confident ones that are wicked !

>> DJ Keith
> Nah, that's my humour... I'm up for it !
Sadly the club DJ's life is very limited.. w/ so much research goin on @ Sony etc.. on a virtual DJ... just a room that can sense the vibe and provide music accordingly !

>>brisbane people were starting to work together and things were happening
>So, when exactly was that for you ? everyone has a different 'Things were happening in Bris Story'..

>>think calm.. have you listened to any lush ambient in a while?
> Yep listening to Aphex Twin - Analogue Bubblebath atm...
nothing new tho !

You need some new lush DnB.. to invigorate some deep down DnB passion !

Neurojack
on a Level !

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Re: WTF Journeyman?????? [long and disjointed reply]

Posted by AliaK on Thursday, 13th December 2001 1:45 AM
198.142.206.211

hey Neurojack, thanks for your reply,

> Yes, I was at Gatecrasher (Melbourne) the week before, and had witnessed the major major technical ####-up's there prior to LTJ playin. Even though the sound for James Lavelle who had just stepped off was fine !..

::: ahh I guess he wasn't too happy with the setups all over aus then :( I'm sure people appreciated him continuing on though.

Believe it or not, LTJ considers me to be the "Australian representative" for progressive DnB !.. and for his labe(Goodlooking)..
though you wouldn't know it from my actions(frustrations) living in Bris of late I guess..

::: that's high praise! it's an excellent label. you're lucky to have the opportunity to help support the music you love in such a way.

>>I think you both play nice music and are obviously both very
passionate about it.
>Thanks heeps, but for an insight into some my 'reasons' please read my reply to Jason !.. yes, we go way back.. I have known Jason for a long time.. and had/spent plenty of time for him ! Just recently a lot has come out of the 'woodwork' which has displeased me greatly !
Feel I have been betrayed etc... and it can't go on !
I am definately not the sort of person to just go and cause trouble believe me, in fact the opposite !

::: yeah that's cool. I'm not really interested in all the details, that's for you guys to sort out. sounds like things have been bubbling for a while, and it's good to get things out in the open, but maybe out in the open between the two of you not here for all and sundry to read? as you;ve probably read from some of the other replies, things like this are sources of amusement to some people but for the people involved it can cause a little stress especially if unexpected. usually this board (seems like a while ago now though) was a bit of fun where ppl could post text on a screen and it was all pretty harmless and a great way to make a boring day at work pass more quickly & nothing was taken too seriously and u could find out what's going on where, who's playing at parties, who's writing music, who's bought new records etc. I guess when there's personal issues posted here then it starts to take the fun out of it all (as I found out a while back & recently when it started up again - at least you signed your own name and explained your ideas!) - going out etc is my escape from all the real world hassles, there's enough politics at work (changing jobs is good for keeping out of work hassles though!) and family/guy hassles or whatever. but people are free to post what they like here which is a good thing so it can't be utopia all the time ;) anyway, I probably shouldn't have posted about it as it's none of my business and I don't even live there anymore but I hate to see people upset. I hope you can come to some sort of truce/understanding/agree to disagree. it's hard to lose friends, especially as you get older when it's harder to make friends.

>>internal fighting between djs starts to spoil this feeling, obviously there's a lot of bottled up feelings...
> In nutshell, there are people who have just 'jumped the bandwagon' due to the ever growing populartity of DnB and tryin to run things... when there was already things in place.. however this is becoming extremely evident in all electronic scenes in Bris ! so evrything is getting a tainted unproffessional feeling.. have lived o/s and currently spend alot of time in other states in Aus, Bris is very unique this way :(

::: yeah a few people have said similar comments about different sub-communities. but maybe people could start looking at it from a different perspective (generally speaking here)? eg instead of the 'I started this, so I should be playing' maybe 'well it started a while back with these people, then these other people came along to help it grow, it's getting healthier, let's all get together and throw in ideas about how it used to be and how it is now and see where we can take it in the future' or something. I don't know. it's too hard for one person/crew. who has the time and energy, especially as you get older and have more other commitments requiring time/energy/money etc. I just think people waste a lot of energy with infighting which could be better put to use in other ways.

>I think it'd be hard to say that one person or one crew was responsible for one style of dnb..
>>Oh, please don't affiliate me with any crews or other dj's.. I have always been a 100% strictly independent.. I was to begin with, so there is no reason to change now.. but yeh everytime I meet a new person, I get associated with this person or that person etc...

::: ok, sorry I didn't mean to infer you were in a crew. it's good to be independent. it's also good for independent people to work together on some things as well sometimes whilst still being able to continue their independent projects. it's a small place, I guess it's hard for people not to be associated with others, because maybe people are jsut assuming that people of similar styles think similarly and would be working together at some stage.

>>breakbeat orientated sound and the fact that many of the ex-grunge crowd are making it the breaks/hip hop/dnb gigs since many of their bands moved to melb and other southern destinations.
> Yes, I've noticed the change in pop of breaks in Bris since end of 97...yes very true about the band thing....

::: isn't it great! there seems to be more opportunity than ever for people playing/writing those styles in bris to play out and to a crowd even ;)

>>in saying that, personally I have a lot of respect for Journeyman because he doesn't just speak passionately about the music he loves, he does something about it - puts on gigs,
actively contacts promoters asking about gigs and if they would be interested in trying a
dnb/2 step night.
> Yeh OK full-prop's...there are just an ever increasing stories of dj/promters...is this healthy ?.. are we gaining anything ?

::: fresh ideas perhaps? I think it's healthy for people who want to have a go to go and try it. they might not end up doing it for long or as successfully as long time promoters but what's the harm?

Is it possible for some people to simple enjoy the art of dj-ing (and be good at it!) without having to bloody put on your own parties and get 'respect' in Brisbane ?

::: of course! and I'm sure people do this anyway playing at home or friends parties. I suppose it comes down to how much the person cared about playing out or to a bigger crowd or about getting 'respect'. I don't know how the bigger promoters decide who plays where, but I guess (and this is just a guess) if they haven't heard from one person in a while or know what they're playing at that time or are familiar with all the various sub-sub-genres etc and someone else sends them a demo or has a chat to them and mentions what they're up to and talk about a party they did and how many people supported them, then it makes the decision a little easier for the promoter who's busy with arranging everything else? I think there's a lot to be said for people wanting to play at gigs to send in updated bios and demos to places where they'd like to play, even if they have been around for years and are well known, though I suppose the guys/girls that have been around for ages usually expect to be asked to play not have to ask for gigs. I guess it never hurts to let people know what your current style is, whether you;re playing more than one style etc as some promoters might be too busy with other things or just relaxing to have caught a prospective djs latest set, or they might have heard they play one style and not realised they played a few.. it'd probably make programming the night and working out the order of the djs a little easier. I don't know.. I'm sure none of this is new to you or anyone else who might be reading, and it might not even be how it works anyway plus I've drifted off topic again..

I spend my whole week doing promotions/graphic design/websites/cd-roms/video production-editing / and organising conferences..
get to the weekend and I just want to DJ.. not what I have just spent the last 50hrs doin... yeh ?

::: yeah that's fair enough. can understand completely. that's why I said that it might not be what everyone would want/be able to do (due to reasons such as you listed). u just have to hook up with someone who doesn't mind the promotion etc. this is one of the reasons I started doing the radio, there were so many people out there who were really passionate about their music and just wanted to play and I don't mind telling other people about people passionate about music so started sending out their bios to maillists and playing their sets.. it's only a small thing, a great hobby for me, gets a few names out there, even if people don't read all the emails or tune in they might at least see the name in the email/post header and remember seeing it somewhere next time they see the name on a flyer. who knows. there's heaps of other people doing things like this as well on a much larger scale such as 4ZzZ, scene, timeoff, rave, brisbane247, vinylknickers, rhythm, spraci, inthemix, 9lives, not to mention the promoters sending out info about their gigs and people playing there & having booklets/flyers with info and even the person themselves just posting on message boards/maillist such as this etc etc so I think there's heaps of opportunities for people who just want to play and not worry about the other stuff - they might need to just spend a short time doing a quick blurb or getting someone to do it for them and voila! (or is this my rose-coloured glasses again) doing these sorts of things is even easier than putting on your own party.

>>self-promotion if their heart is in the right place.
> It's all for the music ! and getting it out there !... LTJ put me on a mission a long time ago... he was so shocked when I told him I have no club residency in Brisbane ! and I'm sposed to be a representative of his music in Aus... yet I go to other states Syd / Melbourne.. I get full respect & props... and offered gig's...
dunno ?

::: ok no excuse now! u have a mission.. to inform and educate more brisbane people of the music? do u have to do it alone? if you haven't time, maybe ask some people to help out and u co-ordinate? don't worry about the gigs here, if you're getting gigs down south, you have a greater amount of people to reach and sooner or later the gigs will come here, or you;ll be too busy flying down here all the time anyway ;)

>>and really, does itmatter who started playing the music first or what gigs they're getting or not getting?
> think 'history' is very important! helps to build a stable foundation for the future.. You cannot deny your history !
But create a false history and ?... the end !

::: yes history is good. but not at the expense of the present and future. it depends how well recorded the history is and what can be learned from it imo. and actually, I'm not sure that the average punter would care that much about it.. most of them are sick of 'the good old days' stories.. they want to create their own 'good old days' I suppose. don't worry about false histories. I'm not sure there's much that can be done about things like that and they are usually not remembered by too many people anyway, especially in this short-attention-span-type community..

>>and does it really matter if peopleplay more than one style either now or in their total career?
> No, not at all....get to sundays and I just wanna chill.. that's strictly downtempo / house for me...
but I don't go sayin that a particaular style of music is crap.. and then 3yrs later decide that's it's all of a sudden not, because there are more people into it... music is a lot deeper than that for me.. more of an inner thing rather than a surface/populartity thing....

::: yeah I can tell that. I guess maybe just concentrate on yourself and not worry about others?

>>dj ego stuff
> What does that mean exactly... shouldn't mix ego w/ confidence ! totally different... like most ego dj's are pretty crap... it's the confident ones that are wicked !

::: no no, I think I know the difference, confidence is good. but I think that a dj with confidence wouldn't care so much about what others think or are doing because they are happy with themselves and they just keep doing what they are doing - more content if you like. it jsut seems to me that hassles with others stems more from ego than confidence, because it is more of a competitive base, and egos like to be fed so the ego-centric personnae require lots of recognition for the person to be happy. I wasn't really directing the ego comment at yourself or suggesting that you have a large ego as I don't know you well enough and would need to speak to you over a period of time to come to one decision or another. I was referring to some other problems I've had recently with egos and that I'm familiar with a few ppl up there who have them. hey I probably do myself as well! ;)

>> DJ Keith
> Nah, that's my humour... I'm up for it !
Sadly the club DJ's life is very limited.. w/ so much research goin on @ Sony etc.. on a virtual DJ... just a room that can sense the vibe and provide music accordingly !

::: yeah I've read about that - interesting to see what'll happen.. there's been lots of debates on some of the maillists about it but I think most people wouldn't go for it and prefer an actual person playing the tunes..

>>brisbane people were starting to work together and things were happening
>So, when exactly was that for you ? everyone has a different 'Things were happening in Bris Story'..

::: well I've got my fond memories of late 80s early nineties which are hard to beat, but I think the last 2 years or so have started to pick up again. I didn't really notice much about what went on back in the earlier days, just enjoyed going out. had a break for a few years, then got back into it all and started paying more attention to what went on. I think there's more opportunity for anyone writing music up there to play out or get their music heard, at least up until the last couple of months anyway.. seems to be some shifting of things going on atm. also, I think more people who are wanting to dj have the oppportunity, as you mentioned it's not so closed now to get gigs as it was a while ago. there's more djs/artists/promoters which I see as a good thing, though maybe not all would agree. promoters seem to be working together more - sharing events, collaborating, introducing new people as well as still keeping the established people playing. there were heaps of venues to play at if you were interested in putting on your own party, and could convince people to move outside the 3block valley radius. though sounds like there;s been some venue problems up there recently. I'm interested as to why you think things aren't happening atm?

>>think calm.. have you listened to any lush ambient in a while?
> Yep listening to Aphex Twin - Analogue Bubblebath atm...
nothing new tho !

::: oooh nice! no I've been broke so haven't had spare cash for records lately except for some badorb.com ones which arrived after a long while. been listening to demos and local artists mostly. actually, have you heard of BJAM from perth.. I think you might like his work. I've put it in my collection next to the glr stuff. he writes and djs.. I was so impressed with his cd - bought it at sound summit. I'll be featuring it in the next couple of weeks and have a few to giveaway, just waiting on some more info from him.

You need some new lush DnB.. to invigorate some deep down DnB passion !

::: that I do! I rediscovered some old john beltram records which I'd forgotten about and misplaced. been listening to some of them lately.

anyway, I can't even remember what I've written in all that above now.. probably should have just emailed it but now I'm too tired to find your email address.

I hope it all works out for all
Kath
[AliaK]

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Re: WTF Journeyman?????? [long and disjointed reply]

Posted by Custa on Thursday, 13th December 2001 4:02 AM
202.138.47.202

Jeez your opinions suck Kath ;-P Disjointed as you think it might have been, made perfect sense to me. Always enjoyable reading your words. Definitely one of the voices of reason around here.

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Re: WTF Journeyman??????

Posted by Neurojack on Wednesday, 12th December 2001 5:14 PM
203.46.38.226

As nice as possible....

>>my first goodlooking record at central by myself in 95 it was horizons by bukem, i didn't even know you that well then !
> The name 'Raze' ring any bells ?... The party 'Underworld'1995 ring any bells ? I think that was out first party/rave playin together !.. And what did you say exactly to Raze when we were sortin out the line-up regarding myself and the best place for Jungle/DnB..? Nasa 5 1995.. sortin out times for jungle/DnB.. what did you say once again regarding myself and jungle / DnB..
But now you like DnB ? OK far enough !.. you cannot deny your history !

>> i will not mention what really hapened in sydney.
> The fact that Matt n Kayla(Syd) did not want me to play ?..or The fact that I was to play beforehand, but played after ?.. Go for it Jason !

>>heard me say to others! 'yeh i play the same sound as neuro' more like if you book me don't put matt and i together as we have a similiar sound !
> eg. Future 01.. what happened there m8 ?.. 2 weeks from playin @ Home in Sydney ?.. and where did u tell Kazu to put me huh ? yes it's good to have friends in the right places yeh ?

>>with the same records at the same time its allways likely that mixes will be similiar !
> Ahh my point exactly m8.. yes I may get my tunes 6mnths or a year ahead of you.. but if I lay down a mix and tape it.. give it to you.. and then 6 months to a year later when you get the same tunes you play the same mixes in the same order.. I GOT TO BE VERY SUS !

>>remember creation a few years ago
> Yep, what did you say to Peter RE: my music and set time ?

>>were you playing dnb before i went overseas - yes i started mixing in a bit of dnb in 94
> Okies m8, so if you got your first DnB tune in 95 ie. Horizons, then WTF were you playing at the dome in 94?.. Hmmmmn sounds of 94.. so must have been Congo Natty or General Levi ?.. ragga muffin stylee or were you droppin in hardcore breaks... somehow I think neither !.. and remembering that I didn't go o/s until 96 !.. In fact, the last gig I did here was "Superstition" @ The Roxy.. guest was MR C (who spent the whole night in the DnB room !)

>>remember in early 97 we used to have mix sessions with cameron brown on the mike at my place
> Yeh man, they were heeps of fun !

>>and in fact we did a mix tape at your house before you went overseas
and you sent the tape to glo and a letter came back signed by bukem/with thanks, you one
one side me on the other ! funny how that gets forgotten !
> Exactly m8.. this is part of the reason I am so pissed at you atm.. ie. That mix tape which I personally gave to Bukem & crew in Brighton (UK)which was recorded at YOUR house did not have you on it !.. why would I put you on there ?.. we have been through this 'over and over'
but for some reason I had 5 people say to me.. "Jason and Cameron got a letter etc..".. which really made me angry at the time ! firstly,there was no mention of me, secondly I was the one who got the bloody letter !
If you can remember recording that tape (I can!).. I recorded first, then you recorded, but you then went and played the first 3 tracks that I did (bad decision !).. otherwise you may have been on that tape! still got the tape !... Alex (Arion) still has the tape.. will be more than happy to refresh you memory !

>>i used to tell everyone that
matt got a letter from bukem ! but never once mentioned myself !
> See above...

>>and also was aware of michael hoggs sets at underground parties. i was just more into trance back then!
> Yes, as you know I lived with Michael Hogg (In Sync / Low Key Operations)

>>turning up the monitors during your set - i arrived backstage to see you shouting at me "the monitors shitting it self, so i got up and thought i would help by turning in down
slightley then you nodded your head "ok" !
>Large imagination you have !.. evrything was fine, then you step up while I'm mixin.. turn-up the monitor to distortion level... I turn and
shout at you ""the monitors shitting itself"

>>a matter of fact a&r manager at good looking records - ltj thanks you for giving him the demo cd its not what he's after but still wants more demo's as he wants to hear new stuff coming from australia,!!!
> Yes, that was from Sinan (GLR)he's good at PR

>>i had no problems with the the decks jumping as that was easily worked
out by using common sense and bieng carefull
> So, the fact that there was no-one (crowd / punters)there to bump/rock/jump on the stage ? helped maybe

>>i had no problems with monitor even with mc supaswift coming through it,
> Once again, the fact that there was no-one there, and the sound was at it's minimum, may have had somethin to do with it...
because as the dancefloor gets full, the sound needs to come up.. when the main sound comes up, the monitors have to come up..
but yeh, gettin the perfect balance takes experience !

>>no wonder drum n bass has trouble!
Nah, I think it's because there are too many unproffessional DJ's
taking the reigns without proper experience.. resulting in an unproffessional scene that people find it hard to get into ! This is actually appearing across the board in electronica in Bris !

When I started playin in Bris, there was none of this "I know the promoter" so I'm playin crap.. or I write for ####.. or I work at ####
it came down to who was the most experienced for the job.. and boy it was hard gettin gig's then.. with a totally closed scene.. Kesson, angus etc..
but now, seems like it's a 'free for all'... evryones a dj/promoter etc...everyones got there own 'way it should be done'.....
How on earth can we build something solid in Brisbane with attitudes
like that..
Even in the outdoor party community (where I came from I guess).. evryone just steals each others ideas.. goes off and does they're own party.. resulting in ?'s of (why didn't people turn up ?) amd I'm not talkin about parties of 1-200...that's a bloody "chill space"...

You have to respect your History and respect those more experienced...
Sorry, but it's absolutely true !!

Now, Jason Reed I think it's best to agree to disagree! But, if you wanna take it further... by all means, I have plenty more !
Like the time, you turned up on my parents doorstep "Oh yeh I left some records here, and Matt said I could get them".. Luckily my Mum knows not to let anyone near my vinyl.. especially if I'm not living there !

L8r

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Re: WTF Journeyman??????

Posted by dom on Wednesday, 12th December 2001 6:32 PM
210.9.79.6

aliak, you are the voice of reason in an otherwise unreasonable world. Just like patience, (which some don't have), tolerance is a virtue.

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Re: WTF Journeyman??????

Posted by :/ on Wednesday, 12th December 2001 6:39 PM
144.137.141.243

yawn.........

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Re: WTF Journeyman??????

Posted by journeyman on Wednesday, 12th December 2001 7:54 PM
210.49.20.22

matt you have definatly smoked to much pot over the years and it has affected your memory.....so many mistakes in their but i'm gonna drop this, you can believe what you like.....a real man would have spoken to me personally but you've chosen these pages to attack me, spraci is not a character assasination page for all to read.

nuff said.

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Re: WTF Journeyman??????

Posted by Neurojack on Thursday, 13th December 2001 11:27 AM
203.46.38.226

>>matt you have definatly smoked to much pot over the years and it has affected your memory.....so many mistakes in their but i'm gonna drop this, you can believe what you like.....a real man would have spoken to me personally but you've chosen these pages to attack me, spraci is not a character assasination page for all to read.

nuff said.

>Nah my memory is 100%...just my short term needs a buffering! In fact I surprise myself and my friends at the state of my mind/memory.. !
Anyway, I had to get all that out and "off my chest".. after having a very personal experience with someone very close who let things 'build up' inside and then destroy them... I know it's not good to keep things "bottled up"...

Yep happy to get on w/ things !
Matt

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Hey Neurojack...

Posted by Idiot on Thursday, 13th December 2001 1:21 PM
203.58.137.2

stop diggin a deeper hole for yourself and go practice your mixing

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Re: Hey Neurojack...

Posted by Neurojack on Thursday, 13th December 2001 1:36 PM
203.46.38.226

Hey Idiot,

So how have I dug a hole... by stating the truth ?
or letting things slip by for a bit too long before somethin recently happened to make me bring it all up !@ eh!

Give yourself cancer by 'bottling' things up inside !

Maybe one day... 'you'll get the gist'

anymore brainless monkeys out there ? that wanna have a go ?
Oh and please make it interesting for the readers, and add some intellect to your postings ! even better some bloody evidence to back up your accusations !
I have !

Neurojack

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Re: Hey Neurojack...

Posted by Idiot on Thursday, 13th December 2001 4:50 PM
203.58.137.2

"Oh and please make it interesting for the readers, and add some intellect to your postings ! even better some bloody evidence to back up your accusations ! I have ! "

Yeah, but no one really gives a fuck. You made yourself look like an idiot by writing all that stuff about being "old school" and the "creator of the sound" not to mention bringing personal beef to the board.

Now everytime anyone sees your name on a flier for a drum & bass gig they will say "isn't that that drum & bass ego boy from spraci"

Yes, tell me they won't, but you know they WILL

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Another thing...

Posted by Idiot on Thursday, 13th December 2001 4:58 PM
203.58.137.2

THEY WILL

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Re: Hey Neurojack...

Posted by Neurojack on Thursday, 13th December 2001 8:09 PM
203.46.38.226

Hi Idiot(2)....

>>Yeah, but no one really gives a fuck. You made yourself look like an idiot by writing all that stuff about being "old school" and the "creator of the sound" not to mention bringing
personal beef to the board.

>Nah.. any evidence of me sayin I'm 'Old School' or "creator of the sound"... check the archives !.. now your just making up crap !
But, yeh anyone in Bris been playin Jungle/DnB longer ??
Yes, I created my own progressive DnB sound.. that has taken me interstate and overseas ! When someone came along and decided.. "yeh I'll copy his idea"... it really sucks !
So, how many others in Bris have created specifically they're own dj style of the DnB sound and have been successful ?? Name me "1" ??

>he he.... oh how surpised you would be if you only new who was actually taking notice of the last few days on this board! very very surprised..
BTW I've specifically told my m8's not to post in my defence! so the 'brainless monkeys' posting utter immature/sub-human crap.. really stand out ! and who are they tryin to defend huh ? Someone's crew sound like a bunch of "try-hard", "wannabee", "newbie".. "special-school drop-outs"....

>>Now everytime anyone sees your name on a flier for a drum & bass gig they will say "isn'tthat that drum & bass ego boy from spraci"
>You know, that is a bloody good thing! because it will create interest and people will be curious to see for themselves.. then realize "hey, I think that Neurojack dude was telling the 'truth' all along !"

>>Yes, tell me they won't, but you know they WILL
Gees I hope 'They will'... no seriously I really hope 'they will' !!

***It's a shame to be dealing w/ someone who has some intellect innit !.. you just don't know what to say !..
so go ahead and use some more brainless profanity !.. and I'll try and expand your mind some more !

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hi, my name is neurojack

Posted by d&B on Thursday, 13th December 2001 9:05 PM
203.58.137.2

"But, yeh anyone in Bris been playin Jungle/DnB longer ??
Yes, I created my own progressive DnB sound.. that has taken me interstate and overseas ! When someone came along and decided.. "yeh I'll copy his idea"... it really sucks !
So, how many others in Bris have created specifically they're own dj style of the DnB sound and have been successful ?? Name me "1" ??"

Do you realise how much of an asshole you sound like... who gives a #### if you were the first person playing the music, cuz you know there were 10 other dudes in their bedroom playing it..

Who copied your idea, and what was your idea anyways? Was your idea to play Drum & Bass... you're just threatened because at the end of the day no one is sittin there analyzing your sets going "oh, journeymen stole neurojacks style"... damn, get over your OLD SCHOOL CREATOR EGO. You''re no god.

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Re: Hi, my name is neurojack

Posted by Neurojack on Thursday, 13th December 2001 10:02 PM
203.46.38.226

I wanna go home... been behind this PC at work since 8am this mornin.. it's now 8.30pm....
so OK one more little bit of education for a "newbie"...lucky I'm burnin a cd !

>>Do you realise how much of an asshole you sound like... who gives a #### if you were the first person playing the music, cuz you know there were 10 other dudes in their bedroomplaying it..

>Bet you said that to your 'vege-school' teacher yeh !
you automatically hate people that try and expand your mind ! is it a threat to you ?

And no m8.. Brisbane is very very small.. I know for a fact that I was the first.. and Michael Hogg (Low Key Operations) was the first Brisbane Jungle/DnB producer... because I lived w/ him... and maybe the fact when we would shop for vinyl, that there was 'none' in Brisbane... and all had to be imported !.. so if there was anyone playin it... they would have had to have been from the UK.. there wasn't even Jungle/DnB in America then !
So, does that clarify anything ?

>>Who copied your idea, and what was your idea anyways?

> Suggest you read previous mails RE: WTF Journeyman !..
OK, my idea was to play DnB in a style that was universal to all my interests in electronica.. this meaning progressive DnB ! most DnB is of the 'hardcore' genre etc... but I had already been through that with Ragga Jungle/Darkside 90-94 and the like ! The style that I have concentrated on, is a alot more mature and takes in aspects of; Progressive House / Prog Trance / Rare Groove / Soul / Hip Hop ...
have you heard of "LTJ Bukem" ?.. then that might be an insight.. but my sound is again a different sound to that of "LTJ Bukem"... a lil more up-front & funky.. rather than totally laid back..and yes I like my soothing sexy female vocals to shiver me all over !

>>you're just threatened because at the end of the day no one is sittin there analyzing your sets going "oh, journeymen stole neurojacks style"... damn, get over your OLD SCHOOL CREATOR EGO. You''re no god.
>No, look the whole point is... I am tryin to successfully push this sound in Bris.. J-man seems to want to put no effort in (ie. mixin).. but seems to do alright by copying my year old sets...J-man's done a couple of crap rooms at other people's party's .. but in reality this is "Brisbane" !
I think that maybe using those "REALISTIC BELT DRIVES" for 7yrs may have affected his 'pitch control / mixin knowledge'... he's gotten
used to the innacuracy of dodgy belt drives...

and now can't mix his way out of a scrambled egg!!!!!
(he he... that's funny!)

***I saved and brought my Technic's when I was 17... yeh I had to work at Coles part-time while at school/uni.. but I eventually did it... I've just turned 27.. so that's 10yrs on SL1200's...the guy I brought them off.. used to be the brother of a good school friend... I actually started mixin after school when I was 15 yrs old on the same decks I have now !
... used to wag friday arvo off school,head into Central Station - Valley (at the time)..and spend the arvo listening to Hip Hop / Rap / Acid House...

Simlar story have you ?

Anyways... I'm off home now
But, I'll probably catch u in the mo'

L8r M8
Neurojack

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equipment snobbery

Posted by Michael MD on Friday, 14th December 2001 2:04 PM
203.29.125.138

I have no idea what this bitching was all about ... so I won't comment on that... (except maybe everyone should sit back, take a deep breath and calm down... peace!)

...but I can't resist making a comment on this...

> I think that maybe using those "REALISTIC BELT DRIVES" for 7yrs
> may have affected his 'pitch control / mixin knowledge'... he's
> gotten
> used to the innacuracy of dodgy belt drives...
>
> and now can't mix his way out of a scrambled egg!!!!!
> (he he... that's funny!)

I have been djing since the 80's and could NEVER afford 1200s...
...and in recent years my priorities have changed (the focus is more on making my own music)

In fact when I first started (back in the 80s) I was using cassette tapes and using the trimpot in the motor voltage regulator for a pitch control.

I started using vinyl in 1987 when I started doing a radio show.

It makes me laugh when I see djs freak out and refuse to play when they get to a party to find that the promoters have cheap belt drive turntables there... or domestic-style turntables...
The panic because they have never used anything other than 1200s and don't think they can cope with anything different... ...

To me this attitude of "you must have the gear with the right brand on it" stinks a bit like the attiude of "i won't talk to you unless you wear clothes with the right label on them"..

yes - 1200s are good turntables... but in the end it really does not matter what tools the dj uses.... what matters is the EFFECT on the people!

> ***I saved and brought my Technic's when I was 17... yeh I had to
> work at Coles part-time while at school/uni.. but I eventually
> did it... I've just turned 27.. so that's 10yrs on SL1200's...the
> guy I brought them off.. used to be the brother of a good school
> friend... I actually started mixin after school when I was 15 yrs
> old on the same decks I have now !

well I admire your motivation...
for me it was always easier to build or modify what I could afford at the time to do what I wanted rather than wait ten years to save money I would have never managed to save to buy what most people seemed to think was needed...

...but at the party it doesn't matter... all that matters is how enjoyable is the vibe?!

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Re: equipment snobbery

Posted by Neurojack on Friday, 14th December 2001 4:30 PM
203.46.38.226

Hi Michael,

>I have been djing since the 80's and could NEVER afford 1200s...
...and in recent years my priorities have changed (the focus is more on making my own music)In fact when I first started (back in the 80s) I was using cassette tapes and using the trimpot in the motor voltage regulator for a pitch control.

>> he he..that's wicked... sounds like the stuff I used to try before dj-ing etc...I used to hook up 3 cassette decks... press play on 2 of them record on the third... or drop voice overs over the top with one of them .. I used record all my fav tracks from Peter Moggs - Dance Show... and try and remix them etc....or just virtually cut-and-paste my fav parts etc... pretty time consuming when you think about it !

>>It makes me laugh when I see djs freak out and refuse to play when they get to a party to find that the promoters have cheap belt drive turntables there... or domestic-style turntables...
> Well if a major major part of your style of mixin involves the layering of keys/melodies(not analogue melodies!) it is crutial to have a spot on 'quartz' lock.. which most other models don't do successfully!

>>The panic because they have never used anything other than 1200s and don't think they can cope with anything different... ...
> Yes, it does throw you etc... but it's good to challenge oneself.. through my experience using other model decks.. you spend the whole time adjusting the pitch back n forth cos there is no proper quartz lock etc...

>>yes - 1200s are good turntables... but in the end it really does not matter what tools the dj uses.... what matters is the EFFECT on the people!
> depends on what you play mate. because I know I can pull off a techno mix or somethin not involving a highly musical(keys melodies) arrangement on virtually any deck w/ pitch etc.. but for my own style w/ keys and melodies to incorporate and layer successfully it is impossible on anything besides SL1200's , SL1210's, or the new Vestax style..
>>well I admire your motivation...for me it was always easier to build or modify what I could afford at the time to do what I wanted rather than wait ten years to save money I would have never managed to save to
buy what most people seemed to think was needed...
> Well, I had known the guy who I got my decks off since grade 9 in highschool 1988 aged 15.. we had an arrangement when I turned 17 that I would purchase the decks... now 1990 etc.. but was wicked because I could take evrything and pay him in part payments over time... he knew how badly I wanted them...
probably took me 6 months to save $1000... and for that I got;
2 x SL1200's, 1x Sony deck(w/ pitch dials), 2 x mixers, 1 x NAD Power AMP, 2 x crappy monitors, 1 x dbl tape deck, 1 x wooden turntable/equipment console(all Tasmanian Pine), 4 x milk crates (acid house, techno, hip hop & some real rarities of each genre) and lastly 1 x vinyl Holder ie. like they record bays in shops etc.. (pine also)
Don't think there are many $1000 deals like that around any more... was a whole studio!!! but that was the advantage of gettin into DJ-ing before it became popular !

>>...but at the party it doesn't matter... all that matters is how enjoyable is the vibe?!
> Yes, but if the vibe rely's very heavily on the equipment.. and may suffer due to crap equipment... what then ?

Anyways, Good Chat m8 ! Anytime !
Thanks
Matt > Neurojack

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Re: equipment snobbery

Posted by Michael MD on Friday, 14th December 2001 5:55 PM
203.29.125.138

> >> he he..that's wicked... sounds like the stuff I used to try
> before dj-ing etc...I used to hook up 3 cassette decks... press
> play on 2 of them record on the third... or drop voice overs over
> the top with one of them .. I used record all my fav tracks from
> Peter Moggs - Dance Show...

maybe I'm showing my age here :-/ ... but i also remember sitting at home taping tasty electro from the radio (shows such as Tim Ritchie's "12 Single Show (JJJ)" and some show on 2mbs about 3am mid week) back in about 1983.
...and yes - I'd make dodgy mix-tapes from them to listen to in the car... never did voice overs on them though (even after doing radio 1987-94 I still don't really like the sound of my own voice)

Funny thing though.. in the mid 90's I started using tapes again... as I found myself with lots of stuff I wanted to play that I could not get on vinyl (and was also starting to make some tracks myself)... CD players with pitch were not yet common at events and I could not afford one myself so for a couple of years I was using modified walkmans (pitchable) to play tracks in my sets that were not on vinyl.
I even went as far as taking a screwdriver with me to tweek the azimuth adjustment on the head if needed (which is disgustingly inaccurate on cassette players and tends to go out at the worst times and playing tapes with misaligned head azimuth can sound VERY bad)

That changed in about 1998 when I modified a portable cd player for pitch. (and got myself a cd-burner so that even my own stuff could go on cd)

> > Well if a major major part of your style of mixin involves the
> layering of keys/melodies(not analogue melodies!) it is crutial
> to have a spot on 'quartz' lock.. which most other models don't
> do successfully!

"Quartz Lock" is only active on 1200s when the pitch control is in the centre. The reason 1200s are more stable wrt speed than most turntables is because (from memory when i looked inside one years ago) they have sensors under the platter and a circuit to keep the platter locked to an oscillator even when the "drag" on the platter varied rather than leaving it up to such unpredictable mechanical variations ... (a variable frequency oscillator when the pitch control is not in the centre - it switches over to the quartz crystal oscillator when the pitch is in the centre - ever noticed the wierd behaviour near the centre on misaligned 1200s?)

> >>yes - 1200s are good turntables... but in the end it really
> does not matter what tools the dj uses.... what matters is the
> EFFECT on the people!

> > depends on what you play mate. because I know I can pull off a
> techno mix or somethin not involving a highly musical(keys
> melodies) arrangement on virtually any deck w/ pitch etc.. but
> for my own style w/ keys and melodies to incorporate and layer
> successfully it is impossible on anything besides SL1200's ,
> SL1210's, or the new Vestax style..

I guess I don't do much of that... I tend to
mix more when things get repetitive (to prevent it getting boring)... and less when there is lots of exciting stuff happening in the tracks (to let those bits have their full effect) and tend to avoid mixing at times when there are melodies going in both tracks.
...I'll will often choose a more "minimal" track to mix with a "full" track... but I do like mixing a variety of styles in a set.

I guess for me the aim is vibe (with the focus "out there") rather than having the attention on the dj (of course a good "show" can be good too - but its not the same thing as a good "vibe manipulator at a party")...
...so to me mixing skills are useful and important parts of the "toolkit", but not the primary aim and I would even say that that playing tasty tracks is *more* important! (which some people might say is blasphemy... but I do see it that way)

> > Well, I had known the guy who I got my decks off since grade 9
> in highschool 1988 aged 15.. we had an arrangement when I turned
> 17 that I would purchase the decks... now 1990 etc.. but was
> wicked because I could take evrything and pay him in part
> payments over time... he knew how badly I wanted them...
> probably took me 6 months to save $1000... and for that I got;
> 2 x SL1200's, 1x Sony deck(w/ pitch dials), 2 x mixers, 1 x NAD
> Power AMP, 2 x crappy monitors, 1 x dbl tape deck, 1 x wooden
> turntable/equipment console(all Tasmanian Pine), 4 x milk crates
> (acid house, techno, hip hop & some real rarities of each genre)
> and lastly 1 x vinyl Holder ie. like they record bays in shops
> etc.. (pine also)
> Don't think there are many $1000 deals like that around any
> more... was a whole studio!!! but that was the advantage of
> gettin into DJ-ing before it became popular !

I don't think I ever remember seeing such equipment at such a price... you were lucky!

Responses

* Re: equipment snobbery
Neurojack -- Friday, 14th December 2001 7:15 PM
o Re: equipment snobbery
DRi- -- Saturday, 15th December 2001 3:40 AM
+ Re: equipment snobbery
dms0 -- Saturday, 15th December 2001 10:12 PM
# Re: equipment snobbery
DRi- -- Sunday, 16th December 2001 7:29 PM
* Re: equipment snobbery
dms0 -- Sunday, 16th December 2001 7:39 PM
o more>

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Re: equipment snobbery

Posted by Neurojack on Friday, 14th December 2001 7:15 PM
203.46.38.226

Hey again...

>>never did voice overs on them though (even after doing radio 1987-94 I still don't really like the sound
of my own voice)

> Sorry no, definately not my voice... meant, I would use voice overs from Doco's and stuff like 'War of the World's' etc... did you ever hear of a guy that went under 'Strangemaster' in Aus.. he used to put voice overs from UFO doco's etc... over the top of his mixes etc... Hmmn probably around 89/90....

>I even went as far as taking a screwdriver with me to tweek the azimuth adjustment on the head if needed (which is disgustingly inaccurate on cassette players and tends to go out
at the worst times and playing tapes with misaligned head azimuth can sound VERY bad)
>> he he....I bet you have pulled decks open to tweek the pitch value !

> > Well if a major major part of your style of mixin involves the
> layering of keys/melodies(not analogue melodies!) it is crutial
> to have a spot on 'quartz' lock.. which most other models don't
> do successfully!

>>- ever noticed the wierd behaviour near the centre on misaligned 1200s?)
> Oh yeh... even w/ brand new ones ! wish they could abolish that little 'pain in the but'....

>>I guess I don't do much of that... I tend to
mix more when things get repetitive (to prevent it getting boring)... and less when there
is lots of exciting stuff happening in the tracks (to let those bits have their full
effect) and tend to avoid mixing at times when there are melodies going in both tracks.
...I'll will often choose a more "minimal" track to mix with a "full" track... but I do
like mixing a variety of styles in a set.
> well the style I mix atm.. I like to start layering the intro approx. 3/4 of the way through the track I'm mixin into.. really into that appegiator(??) thing w/ the layering.. helps keep that permanence to the sound w/ getting boring... but yes, variation is the key !

>>tasty tracks is *more* important!(which some people might say is blasphemy... but I do see it that way)
> Totally agree w/ you there m8 !.. but also programming!!
That guy I mentioned earlier 'Strangemaster' and another oldie 'Zentreadi' would concentrate on track's and programming rather than mixin... and boy did it make a difference... made the music so interesting.. when not concerned w/ tryin to find a perfect match to mix into etc... they could build the vibe 'incredibly'...
the only person who I've seen w/ a similar mixin style is Giles Peterson.. have you heard him mix ?.. or well play ?

>>I don't think I ever remember seeing such equipment at such a price... you were lucky!
Well at the time.. DJ-ing wasn't ummmn so popular... in fact the guy I brought them off.. would always make sure I knew what I was gettin into etc... basically offered him $1k for just the decks etc... but as he was moving state.. managed to score the whole studio.. being 17 w/ a full DJ studio was pretty lucky I guess.. but my mate's were buying cars etc... that's just what my goal was I guess.. the main thing was the rare vinyl.. didn't know it at the time.. but had scored some real gems.. mainly early funk / hip hop / acid house / house etc...
but still to this day I have them all ! But, yeh the decks are suffering comsmetically ie. sweat has stripped quite a bit off the surface etc.. but otherwise.. just replace the pitch evry so often.. but yep definately the best investment I have ever made !

>> A mate of mine in Wales(UK)is studying product & industrial design.. he just did this assignment on vinyl.. I found it really very interesting.. made me think "why the #### are we using vinyl" if the sound quality is so 'lossy' etc.. it's amazing that the vinyl format has survived for so long..
it's just the DJ's that are keepin it alive !
You might find it interesting...

Anyways mate!
Pleasure once again !
Matt > Neurojack